IP 31 chain plate

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1 year 9 months ago #4039 by patone
Have the IP 31s made in the mid 80s been subject to the IP chain plate failure issue

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1 year 9 months ago - 1 year 9 months ago #4040 by thor
SORRY but the chain plates on mid 80s 31 packets were a POS. , want great chain plates buy a Catalina. Want a great boat buy a Packet.. Boating many compromises . Thisubject is a hot point with me , if you have a packet over 20 years old and not replaced the chain plates, don't take it any place you can't walk home from . There may have been quality control but not here. How do I know, I have owned a 31 packet#112 for 19 years. My cha...in plates broke on Key West channel 12knot beam reach, a million dollar day almost. So my input replace them now and sail .Need more info get back to me

Fair wind
Thor
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Last Edit: 1 year 9 months ago by thor. Reason: dup. photo
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1 year 9 months ago - 1 year 2 months ago #4050 by hayden
Pat and all IP owners:

To answer your question, YES, you should replace your chain plates if your boat is pre 1997. It was around this timeframe, and we cannot get an exact date or production number, but during this timeframe production and processes of the chain plates changed to make them stronger and better. That means there are about 1,000+ IPs that "should" have their chain plates replaced. We had our IP35, 1994 model trucked back to the Island Packet Yachts factory and we were the first yacht to start off the IPY REFIT program. We went in for chain plate replacements. Guess what? Our chainplates were all just fine, no cracks, no issues, no problem. Well, now I have the newer thicker designs and I am good to go another 20 years. Also, guess what? I never repacked these chain plates in 15 years! I simply kept them sealed via the top with silicone each year. I am not a big believer in the need to repack chain plates, just keep them sealed. Water getting into the area is not really the issue. It is more than that.
Bottom line, if you IP is pre 1997, then I would think about replacing the chain plates. This costs about $10K.

Hayden

Hayden Cochran
IP35-165 Island Spirit
IslandSpirit35.blogspot.com
Rock Hall, MD
Last Edit: 1 year 2 months ago by hayden.

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1 year 9 months ago #4071 by KurtIP31
Thor - is there an easy (?) way to inspect them or do we need to dig them out of the hull?

thank you,

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1 year 9 months ago #4080 by thor
Kurt, unfortunately with the IP chain plate methods NO. If you rip apart the interior the chain plates are glassed in, and the parts that are probably at risk are between the deck joint and teak toe rails. Seriously if you have a 31 you need to replace them. I say this because I love my 31, The chain plates, a hairy wart on the nose of a lovey ship.
Easy to check, NO . Easy to replace NO. I say this because I did it myself. It was worth the labor and I am more familiar with my boat. The new plates obtained thru the builder were better built.
You must strip the starboard and port salon and the head to the hull, be careful remove the screw plugs and screws and work it apart . the liner in the head will have to be cut to remove, you can splice it together when replacing it. A good grinder and lots of work will get out the old chain plates. Don't forget to support the mast It is a well built ship and things will not come apart easily. Large glassed in bulkheads do not need to be removed, praise be.. A tyvec suit and very good respirator a must.
Went sailing all last week and am glad This is behind me. Its not a new boat but I strive to keep it like new. It has given me plenty of trouble free years of trouble free sailing.
Good luck and fair winds
Thor




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1 year 2 months ago #4567 by Emergpa1
Are the rear stay chainplates also replaced?

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1 year 2 months ago #4573 by Sailup
In our case, all 8 were replaced, yes. I could not imagine only doing 6. Also a good time to check and replace any of the bobstay hardware IMHO.

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1 year 2 months ago #4575 by Delicia
Once again I seem to be the contrarian view here. But for what its worth. If I were faced with this problem I would go the external chain plate route - Cheaper, easily inspected, less interior work, and could be made as strong as you want. Also at resale time there is not dispute about their condition. Anyone buy in a used IP is going to be alarmed by all this chain plate chatter. Furthermore, I don't believe that they all need to be done on boats earlier than 1997. It depends on how well they have been maintained. ( Hayden had his done, they were good, his IP is a 1995 and he said that he had not done any real maintenance). If the boat has spent a lot of time in fresh, cold, or brackish water, it is less likely that they are damaged. Also, they can be inspected with a fiber optic camera by drilling some small holes in the teak interior. They can be inspected all the way thru the deck from the top by digging out all the packing and opening the cap rail bit.

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1 year 2 months ago #4583 by Emergpa1

Delicia wrote: Once again I seem to be the contrarian view here. But for what its worth. If I were faced with this problem I would go the external chain plate route - Cheaper, easily inspected, less interior work, and could be made as strong as you want. Also at resale time there is not dispute about their condition. Anyone buy in a used IP is going to be alarmed by all this chain plate chatter. Furthermore, I don't believe that they all need to be done on boats earlier than 1997. It depends on how well they have been maintained. ( Hayden had his done, they were good, his IP is a 1995 and he said that he had not done any real maintenance). If the boat has spent a lot of time in fresh, cold, or brackish water, it is less likely that they are damaged. Also, they can be inspected with a fiber optic camera by drilling some small holes in the teak interior. They can be inspected all the way thru the deck from the top by digging out all the packing and opening the cap rail bit.

I would love to do the external chain plates! however here are the problems I see with that.
1. There are no pre-made chain plates for this, I would have to order them custom-made and know precisely where all the holes would have to be, the curvature etc. I have no idea how to do that.
2. Also I have no idea where I would drill the holes in the hull to put the chain plates. How would I know that the holes I'm drilling would go through the old chai plates or are in the right place?
3. I am seriously considering doing my own chain plates and so would appreciate any additional advice.
3.

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1 year 1 month ago #4684 by cj
I have an IP 31 and did the chain plate replacement myself about 1 1/2 years ago. I ordered the new plates made of 316 SS from Chain Plate Express in Texas. I had them made individually made instead of the original design, I saw no reason to tie 3 chain plates together with a long crossbar, price was less than 50% of what IP wanted for the chain plate kit. I did get the FG strands and sealant from IP. It's a labor intensive, time consuming job, that's why they want 10K, but it's doable. I documented it with pictures the on the Home Port website. I haven't been on this forum for some time, hence the late post on this topic.

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1 year 1 month ago #4688 by Emergpa1

cj wrote: I have an IP 31 and did the chain plate replacement myself about 1 1/2 years ago. I ordered the new plates made of 316 SS from Chain Plate Express in Texas. I had them made individually made instead of the original design, I saw no reason to tie 3 chain plates together with a long crossbar, price was less than 50% of what IP wanted for the chain plate kit. I did get the FG strands and sealant from IP. It's a labor intensive, time consuming job, that's why they want 10K, but it's doable. I documented it with pictures the on the Home Port website. I haven't been on this forum for some time, hence the late post on this topic.

One of most frustrating things about our website here is lack of ability to find photos. They should be attached to the members profile page. I tried the Google search, browsing etc.

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10 months 2 weeks ago #4889 by Judith
Regrettably, I agree with emergepa1. Photos hard to find. :S

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5 months 2 days ago #5263 by Bluwatrsalr
I'm a little late to the discussion, but having recently purchased an IP 31, I was wondering if anyone has put together a "How To" procedure on chain plate replacement.

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4 months 3 weeks ago #5272 by thor
If your chain plates have not been replaced, do not pass go, replace now, main upper , lowers aft and Bob stay upper and lower, bobstay , do it to. My experience, forget the original plan Go for a bolt on sandwich type , reinforce and orientate to the load, use a backing plate on the exterior, the hole in the toe rail now filled. Did that on my aft stays, I replaced the Bob stay while still in the water. It can be done. This was a BS part of a great ship, that said all chain plates have a life cycle, not as long as this great boat. So buying a used or owning an older boat comes with an onus, stainless parts may not rust, but they have a life span, don't believe me, ask a stainless fabricator. More questions I'm here,
Fair winds
Thor
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4 months 3 weeks ago #5274 by cj
Here are photos of my chainplate install on my 31. I did it myself. Had the new plates made individually, didn't cover them with FG like the factory, so if water won't get trapped. Considered going to external, but the interior still has to be removed, so for resale I went with the factory design more of less. I took me about 6 weeks 4-5 hours a day. I agree with Thor... don't sail an old IP anywhere you can't walk home if you still have the original chainplates. Cliff

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4 months 3 weeks ago #5282 by Bluwatrsalr
Thanks Cliff,
The pictures help a ton....my partner and I tried to use a bore scope for inspection, but all we see is FG. We know this is in front of us, but we just got the boat clean and ready for a short sail. Ok.... maybe we can't walk home but we can motor home from around the Hamton Roads harbor. Looks like this winter will be time for a major project. Thanks guys....reality is a sometime tough....but it is nice to have folks who keep keep it real. Many thanks to Thor for comments as well.
John Kennedy

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4 months 3 weeks ago #5285 by cj
John
If you decide to do the replacement yourself, here are a couple of tips that may help. When you take apart the interior keep in mind that most pieces are glued as well as screwed together (at least on my 31 they were). Get a good scraper, and after the screws are removed tap the scraper with a hammer to break the glue bond. The port side main salon hanging locker is glassed in, top and bulkhead. Make sure you label best you can, what screws go where, as there are a lot of screws to remove. In the head, I removed only the top cabinet above the sink, I found it gave me enough room to get at the plates, plus on my boat the original FG strands only went down a couple of feet, which is plenty of length. I hand a pro glass man remove the chainplates, that was something I did not want to mess with, but I did the install of the new ones myself. You will need a helper when you install the new ones.... someone has to be on deck to connect the stays to keep the new plates in position, and add some tension. I used West systems epoxy, the slower cure, it gives you the time you need to wet down the FG strands. If you have any questions, let me know.
Cliff

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4 months 3 weeks ago #5289 by mgraham
I have just finished having Mack Sails in Stuart Fl. Look on the Mack Sails web site, and there is a specific YouTube video link on their doing the replacement. It was fixed fee job, at a reasonable price, and I know it has been done right. I don't know whether the cabinetry on our boat is really any different than on a 31. BTW, when removed, our chainplates had a number of fractures.

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2 weeks 2 hours ago #5504 by hstory74
Appreciate your post. I am going to have to do the chainplate replacement also. Where did you find the specifications for the chainplates so you could get them made and did you change the chainplates for the backstays. Who made your replacement chainplates? -- Hugh

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1 week 5 days ago #5512 by thor
JRT stainless fabrication 1510 51st Gulfport fl 33707 be sure to replace the back stays and bobstay,upper and lower. He built back stay a sandwich system with back up on the exterior, I should have done all of them sandwiched and oriented to the load..
Thor
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